Ghost bass?

May 27, 2012

  1. phongs

    phongs
    1 posts
    Since Feb 20, 2011
    So while I was reading Bassnectars' liner notes for the song "Pennywise Tribute" off his new album Vava Voom, I stumbled across something that peaked my interest.

    I use Ableton and would like to try to recreate something similar. I'm think he means writing a bassline at C1 (32.7hz) or some note down there, which most people without a really nice sound system can't hear. Then throwing another sine wave an octave higher (C2 65hz) which would sound alright on most systems. What do you guys think?:question:?
  2. NevJR

    NevJR
    715 posts
    Since Oct 30, 2009
    Just sounds like what waves maxx bass does.
  3. satboy Banned by DOA

    satboy
    744 posts
    Since Mar 10, 2012
    i think you are an american

    there are 2 solutions: distort the original C1 sine so it gains harmonics and then LPF it around 200Hz OR have a square wave at C2 and LPF it arounnd 200Hz.

    65Hz would still be inaudible (or at least very muted) at an average home audio.

    imo compromises are stupid things. why not make a version for club sound systems and one for the radio&home&car?
  4. SAYjour

    SAYjour
    16 posts
    Since Aug 8, 2011
    I'd bet it's this. Leaves the low end alone and mixes in distortion on the higher end of the bass.
  5. kwikshot Takaci

    kwikshot
    505 posts
    Since Nov 18, 2009
    That would kinda defeat the purpose of mastering...
  6. satboy Banned by DOA

    satboy
    744 posts
    Since Mar 10, 2012
    mastering would still be useful: consistency across consumer devices and consistency across club sound systems... double-useful in fact :wink:
  7. luthatron \o/ Lord Wavey \o/

    luthatron
    42,245 posts
    Since Feb 3, 2004
    saturate it and then lowpass it to remove anything harsh or too high. roll off subbass and mix back in with sub.

    C1 is too low for nearly everything to play though, E1 is about as low as it gets normally.
  8. vanilla2k

    vanilla2k
    10 posts
    Since May 7, 2012
    What would be the effect on headroom of going so low? I've repeatedly read that you should cut off anything below 30 because it can eat up headroom. Would this not apply when only the sub is down there?
  9. luthatron \o/ Lord Wavey \o/

    luthatron
    42,245 posts
    Since Feb 3, 2004
    C1 is too low for sub, the sounds breaks apart (i assume due to the really low oscillations being too slow) and it sounds more like an LFO.

    E1 and F1 are about as low as you can go before it sounds shit.
  10. kramz

    kramz
    1,787 posts
    Since Mar 18, 2008
    The problem for me, (especially on this forum) is that numerous times people have talked about musical notes, but never mention the synthesizer oscillator frequency. If you have a high enough oscillator frequency, you could have a C1 note that hits in the 500hz range, or basically any frequency range your little heart desires. Are you guys using some sort of standard synthesizer oscillator frequency that I'm unaware of for reference? Or are you missing this fact all together?
  11. SquirrelTamer

    SquirrelTamer
    2,998 posts
    Since Nov 11, 2003
    Well it's not a C1 anymore then is it
  12. luthatron \o/ Lord Wavey \o/

    luthatron
    42,245 posts
    Since Feb 3, 2004
    it's just normal pitch, what a band would tune to or an orchestra or the default tuning for a synth.

    http://www.phy.mtu.edu/~suits/notefreqs.html

    C1 is 32.70 hz.

    if the oscillator isn't playing 32.70hz it's not C1.

    you can detune the synth and trigger what you think is C1 on the keyboard, but you've detuned it - it's not C1.

    if you play 500hz it's not C1. you could sample a 500 hz tone and load it on a sampler on the note C1 - it's still not C1.

    edit: think about an out of tune guitar. you may think you are playing E3 on it but you aren't as it's out of tune. it looks like it's E3, you fret the correct note but it's out of tune, so you aren't actually playing E3

    more edits; i'm not saying that you should never use C1 i think i phrased some of the earlier posts badly, just that it's getting a bit too low around there as the frequency is so slow, it sounds OK (just) on my big headphones but it's not really audible on cheapo in ear jobbies.
  13. Airstrike aka Maiki

    Airstrike
    1,340 posts
    Since Jan 9, 2008
  14. kramz

    kramz
    1,787 posts
    Since Mar 18, 2008
    :laughing:
  15. kramz

    kramz
    1,787 posts
    Since Mar 18, 2008
    Thanks for clarifying. What kind of headphones do you use?
  16. luthatron \o/ Lord Wavey \o/

    luthatron
    42,245 posts
    Since Feb 3, 2004
  17. mehta

    mehta
    2,986 posts
    Since Sep 20, 2007
    30hz is not too low for sub, although many sound engineers high pass their systems at 35hz or even 40hz (which sounds very thin to me)
  18. WALSH350

    WALSH350
    2,131 posts
    Since Jan 1, 2005
    A 30hz low cut is normal. A 30hz hi pass is not. Etcetcetc
  19. flyingmidget

    flyingmidget
    557 posts
    Since Mar 4, 2008
    I remember when I was looking at the remix stems for BMT's All or Nothing and the bass had some very low G (24.50 Hz) notes. When I first heard the tune I honestly though there was something weird going on, and only when I got the stems did I realize, but I think they pulled it off in top form: the saturation lets you know that there is a low note there, but I couldn't hear the sub at all. Could be my gear, could be the master who knows. So low notes are possible, although if you get something like a saw down that low it just sounds like garbage. Sin + saturation is the only way to go.
  20. Almighty Alias

    Almighty Alias
    46 posts
    Since Mar 23, 2012
    This is exactly what I thought as well... read the maxx bass page over at waves website.... sounds just like the OP's description.